RE: [soa-forum] Fw: [CAnet - news] SOA versus Web 2.0

["Chiusano Joseph" <chiusano_joseph@xxxxxxx>]

I believe the OASIS SOA-RM can provide a foundation for Web 2.0's advancement because of Web 2.0's focus on collaboration. Such collaboration is facilitated by interoperability among multiple SOA implementations (meaning among the services that these implementations provide), and this interoperability can be facilitated by an enhanced ability to relate and compare multiple SOA implementations - and such an enhanced ability can be provided by the SOA Reference Model.

 

Joe

 

Joseph Chiusano

Associate

Booz Allen Hamilton

 

700 13th St. NW, Suite 1100

Washington, DC 20005

O: 202-508-6514 

C: 202-251-0731

Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com

 

---

From: soa-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:soa-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Paul S Prueitt
Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 6:22 PM
To: Service-Oriented Architecture CoP
Subject: RE: [soa-forum] Fw: [CAnet - news] SOA versus Web 2.0

Is there something that one can directly compare W* or Web 2.0 or what ever (is W* sameAs Web 2.0)  to the OASIS SOA RM?

 

Joe, in my humble opinion, the links below have more information than one needs (information about the author(s) and about his/their opinions).

 

 

 

To the SOA CoP...

 

OASIS SOA RM is in my opinion complete adequate and sufficient for social transformations that I am hoping to help.

 

As has been mentioned, the "phenomenon" of case based reasoning is vital to causing the types of complicated cascades that are needed in a new type of computing and communication .  Computers need these cases enumerated.  Web-ontology is doing this now days and doing it well, in a few cases.  Human communication needs choice points (BCM standard) and measurements to test when the cases are not adequate in a particular situation. 

 

 

What most miss is that human reasoning is constantly in touch with reality, what I and others (Aldo de Moor) call the pragmatic axis.

 

The OASIS SOA RM does not miss this, and yet most other standards do miss this - particularly (the judgment can be made) W3C standards.  (Show me one that does, and I will be very happy to review it.)  The reason why this is a RM and not an architecture is to correct architectures that have no or little reference capabilities to natural processes.  (Again, this means process models and really alignment to real temporal events.)  This is a call for a principled discussion if someone feels slighted by a slight critic of W3C. 

 

The issue is clarity of the standards, and fidelity to the natural processes that the standards should be helping us model and assist ourselves and others with "web services".  Yes?

 

This is where an alignment with the OASIS SOA-RM is necessary, because this RM is correct (in the context I am speaking) and because of the break through (conceptually) within the leadership (some of it) of the Federal CIO Council, in this context.  We feel that more than any other thing, other than an awareness of n-ary ontology and Ontology referential bases, this alignment to the OASIS RM has the greatest merit. 

 

Stakeholders will understand this alignment, but we need to demonstrate that we have mastered this RM and understand how to do web service architectures within the scope of the RM. 

 

In my mind, not having seen all standards, for me.....The SOA-RM, the FERA (Federated Enterprise Reference Architecture) and the following other standards complete a  * cover over the high level standards the federal government should adopt.

 

SOA-IM (Information Model)

SOA-CS (Collaborative Services)

BCM (Business Centric Methodology) adopted at OASIS in April 2006. 

 

ebXML (electronic business XML) strongly supported by SUN and reasonably good.

 

* by cover, I mean that all of the issues are taken care of at one level (in this case the high level cover is a conceptual cover). 

 

 

Paul Prueitt

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: soa-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:soa-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Chiusano Joseph
Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 3:06 PM
To: Service-Oriented Architecture CoP
Subject: RE: [soa-forum] Fw: [CAnet - news] SOA versus Web 2.0

For those scratching their head wondering what Web 2.0 is, here are some good resources:

 

http://blogs.ittoolbox.com/eai/cto/archives/007200.asp (“Web 2.0: The Web as the Global SOA")

http://webservices.sys-con.com/read/164532.htm (“Web 2.0 The Global SOA")

http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1906053,00.asp ("Web 2.0 Label Lacks Meaning, Magic")

http://web2.wsj2.com/creating_open_service_apisthat_last_and_anyone_can_use.htm ("Creating Open Services That Last And Anyone Can Use")

 

Joe

 

Joseph Chiusano

Associate

Booz Allen Hamilton

 

700 13th St. NW, Suite 1100

Washington, DC 20005

O: 202-508-6514 

C: 202-251-0731

Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com

 

---

From: Chiusano Joseph
Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 5:01 PM
To: 'Service-Oriented Architecture CoP'
Subject: RE: [soa-forum] Fw: [CAnet - news] SOA versus Web 2.0

Thanks Susan. Here is another excellent piece on this very topic from late last week, from SOA analyst Joe McKendrick:

 

http://www.webservices.org/weblog/joe_mckendrick/web_2_0_or_soa_web_2_0_and_soa_let_the_debate_begin_part_2

 

Joe

 

Joseph Chiusano

Associate

Booz Allen Hamilton

 

700 13th St. NW, Suite 1100

Washington, DC 20005

O: 202-508-6514 

C: 202-251-0731

Visit us online@ http://www.boozallen.com

 

---

From: soa-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:soa-forum-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of susan.turnbull@xxxxxxx
Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 4:58 PM
To: soa-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [soa-forum] Fw: [CAnet - news] SOA versus Web 2.0

FYI -
I wasn't aware of consternation between SOA and Web 2.0.  I just think of open API mash-ups as SOA-lite.
Susan

Susan B. Turnbull
Senior Program Advisor
Office of Intergovernmental Solutions
Office of Citizen Services and Communications
US General Services Administration
p 202.501.6214
susan.turnbull@xxxxxxx
http://www.gsa.gov/intergov
----- Forwarded by Susan B. Turnbull/XCI/CO/GSA/GOV on 05/09/2006 04:55 PM -----

"Bill St.Arnaud" <bill.st.arnaud@xxxxxxxxxx>
Sent by: news-bounces@xxxxxxxxxx

05/09/2006 03:28 PM

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Subject	[CAnet - news] SOA versus Web 2.0

For more information on this item please visit the CANARIE CA*net 4 Optical
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-------------------------------------------

[Some excerpts from Jon Hagel's blog. Thanks to a contributor who wishes to
remain anonymous-- BSA]

http://edgeperspectives.typepad.com/edge_perspectives/2006/04/soa_versus_web
_.html

SOA Versus Web 2.0?

As I indicated in my previous posting, a cultural chasm separates these two
technology communities, despite the fact that they both rely heavily on the
same foundational standard - XML. The evangelists for SOA tend to dismiss
Web 2.0 technologies as light-weight "toys" not suitable for the "real" work
of enterprises.  The champions of Web 2.0 technologies, on the other hand,
make fun of the "bloated" standards and architectural drawings generated by
enterprise architects, skeptically asking whether SOAs will ever do real
work.

Both Web 2.0 and SOA technologies re-conceive software as services. Perhaps
even more importantly, they view services as platforms.  Rather than viewing
services as standalone offers designed to be consumed exactly as written,
both sets of technologies start with the vision that the role of any service
is ultimately to become the building block for even more services that will
be built on top of the original service.

Amazon provides an early, and very limited, example of this opportunity.  By
developing an affiliate program and offering a book buying service that can
be embedded into other web sites, Amazon has been able to significantly
expand its reach and create a much more robust platform for driving
e-commerce activity.

The growing appeal of Web 2.0 technologies in part stems from this hijacking
of SOAs.  Line executives within the enterprise are experiencing mounting
frustration over the escalating hype around SOAs, the growing spending over
SOA design initiatives and the relatively limited business impact achieved
by SOA deployments.  In contrast, Web 2.0 initiatives are leading to a
proliferation of mashups (one form of composition), as described by Dion
Hinchcliffe in "The Web 2.0 Mashup Ecosystem Ramps Up" and "Some Predictions
for the Coming 'Mashosphere' "


Does this mean SOAs are DOA? Not at all.  SOAs still provide a valuable
foundation to support the sustained relationships required for distributed
creation.  But these SOAs need to be deployed in a much more incremental and
pragmatic way.  Perhaps a little competition from Web 2.0 technologies will
help to break the logjam and force both IT departments and IT consultants to
adapt their culture and operations to growing business pressure for
accelerated impact and learning.

As JSB and I discuss in much more detail in The Only Sustainable Edge, the
convergence of SOAs, virtualization architectures and Web 2.0 social
software will drive the next wave of value creation within and across
enterprises.  The convergence will not unfold smoothly, as much of the
current debate confirms, but it will take place - there is too much at stake
and each of these technology arenas offers something distinctive in
supporting next generation business platforms.





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